Germans Told US That Curveball Was Unreliable, But Bush Went Ahead Anyway
This is what I will never understand... Don't you think it would behoove the leader of the country to triple-check the data before committing troops to a war where lives will be lost and billions of dollars would be spent? See, because I would look like a complete moron if I went ahead with such a costly operation if I decided to cherry pick my intel and not get MANY additional confirmations.
I would CERTAINLY triple-check my intel if the German government was telling me my source was prone to exaggeration, among other things:
Then again, when you're George W. Bush, you kinda do whatever you want.
I would CERTAINLY triple-check my intel if the German government was telling me my source was prone to exaggeration, among other things:
Curveball's German handlers for the last six years said his information was often vague, mostly secondhand and impossible to confirm.
"This was not substantial evidence," said a senior German intelligence official. "We made clear we could not verify the things he said."
The German authorities, speaking about the case for the first time, also said that their informant suffered from emotional and mental problems. "He is not a stable, psychologically stable guy," said a BND official who supervised the case. "He is not a completely normal person," agreed a BND analyst.
Then again, when you're George W. Bush, you kinda do whatever you want.
by MG at 2:45 PM
12 Comments:
That last link to Americablog is kinda scary I think. If true then the world is in trouble, because Bush is serving someone other than the American people...
This sounds almost as though Rummy is playing pass the buck though. Moxie, I have come accross some BBC documentaries (3 part series 1 hr each), and although a lot of it is questionable (surrounding the precipitate of 911), but the history it shows of the neo-conservative rise to power is quite interesting to know about.
Do you accept ripped CD's via mail? I'll email you on this, but if there was any way you could incorporate it into your site, I think a lot of people would benefit from the knowledge of some parts...you'll know which ones if you watch them.
Back to the post though, Rumsfeld could not have been left out-in-the cold about invading Iraq, I call BS. They had this planned for quite some time I think, after all the war on terror is the new cold-war. They used this to control people and restore their former might. They are repeating the SAME EXACT DAMN propaganda BS they did before. Thanks to things like the internet, they are getting caught this time - time to run for cover...
"Thanks to the internet".
Indeed. The elongated noses will be revealed.
For an administration that has poll numbers only slighty north of satan, they sure are slow to learn.
The eye opening is coming soon, and when it does, it will just get that much nastier. There is no "I" in team, and there is no ability for them to come clean since "I" is all that matters.
"German authorities, speaking about the case for the first time, also said that their informant suffered from emotional and mental problems. "He is not a stable, psychologically stable guy," said a BND official..."
Hmm. Empathy for a kindred mind must have outweighed all else, when Bush heard Curveball described so glowingly.
But then, what else can you expect from someone who likely believes his handling of Katrina and its aftermath is proof that he's fulfilling his promise to "...work to restore and to improve and to protect at least three million acres of wetlands over the next five years"?
simon jakis said...
That last link to Americablog is kinda scary I think. If true then the world is in trouble, because Bush is serving someone other than the American people...
Kinda scary indeed...
Video
Rumsfeld: I Didn't Advocate Invasion
On This Week, Stephanopoulos asked Rumsfeld, had he known the intelligence concerning WMDs was inaccurate, if he would have still advocated going to war with Iraq. Rumsfeld responded by stating that he was never asked. Imagine that, Bush never consulted the Secretary of Defense regarding the case for war.
"I didn't advocate invasion, I wasn't asked." - Rumsfeld said
I call BullShit!
January 26, 1998
The Honorable William J. Clinton
President of the United States
Washington, DC
Dear Mr. President:
....We urge you to articulate this aim, and to turn your Administration's attention to implementing a strategy for removing Saddam's regime from power[READ- PLEASE REMOVE SADDAM]. This will require a full complement of diplomatic, political and military efforts. Although we are fully aware of the dangers and difficulties in implementing this policy, we believe the dangers of failing to do so are far greater. We believe the U.S. has the authority under existing UN resolutions to take the necessary steps, including military steps [READ- OFFENSIVE MILITARY INVASION OK], to protect our vital interests in the Gulf. In any case, American policy cannot continue to be crippled by a misguided insistence on unanimity in the UN Security Council [READ- GO IT ALONE OK]....
Donald Rumsfeld
Paul Wolfowitz
John Bolton
Richard L. Armitage
Elliott Abrams
Richard Perle
William J. Bennett
William Kristol...
When exactly did Rummy change his mind?
I agree Sans - he was ALL for it before.
While Bush is busy telling anyone who will still listen that the Democrats are being "irresponsible" in "claiming" that the intelligence regarding Iraq was manipulated, lying that the Senate saw exactly the same "intelligence" that he did, his lies are steadily being undercut by people's recollections of what actually happened. For one, the German intelligence officials stating plainly that they warned the C.I.A. that "Curveball" was unreliable, as this thread by Moxie Grrrl demonstrates, which is also backed up by an article today in the Washington Post called "C.I.A. Was Warned on Iraq Informer--Germans say U.S. exaggerated claims".
For another, in yesterday's Washington Post editorial page, a letter was written in by Bob Graham who at that time was the chairman of the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence, someone who was in a job where could say from a position of knowledge that the intel was manipulated, as he saw what was shown to the Senate as well as what wasn't. He states:
"At a meeting of the Senate intelligence committee on Sept. 5 2002, C.I.A. Director George Tenet was asked what the National Intelligence Estimate (NIE) provided as the rationale for a preemptive war in Iraq. An NIE is the product of the entire intelligence community, and its most comprehensive assessment. I was stunned when Tenet said that no NIE had been requested by the White House and none had been prepared. Invoking our rarely used senatorial authority, I directed the completion of an NIE. Tenet objected, saying that his people were too committed to other assignments to analyze Saddam's capabilities and will to use chemical, biological and possibly nuclear weapons. We insisted, and three weeks later the community produced a classified NIE. There were troubling aspects to this 90-page document. While slanted toward the conclusion that Hussein possessed weapons of mass destruction stored or produced at 550 sites, it contained vigorous dissents on key parts of this information, especially by the departments of State and Energy. Particular skepticism was raised about aluminum tubes that were offered as evidence Iraq was reconstituting its nuclear program. As to Hussein's will to use whatever weapons he might have, the estimate indicated he would not do so unless he was first attacked. Under questioning, Tenet added that the information in the NIE had not been independently verified by an operative responsible to the United States. In fact, no such person was inside Iraq. Most of the alleged intelligence came from Iraqi exiles or third countries, all of which had an interest in the United States' removing Hussein, by force if neccessary. The American people needed to know these reservations, and I requested that an unclassified, public version of the NIE be prepared. On Oct. 4, Tenet presented a 25-page document titled "Iraq's Weapons of Mass Destruction Programs". It represented an unqualified case that Hussein possessed them, avoided a discussion of whether he had the will to use them and omitted the dissenting opinions contained in the classified version. Its conclusions, such as "If Baghdad acquired sufficient weapons-grade fissile material from abroad, it could make a nuclear weapon within a year" underscored the White House's claim that exactly such material was being provided from Africa to Iraq. From my advantaged position, I had earlier concluded that a war with Iraq would be a distraction from the successful and expeditious completion of our aims in Afghanistan. Now I had come to question whether the White House was telling the truth-- or even had an interest in knowing the truth. On Oct. 11, I voted no on the resolution to give the president the authority to go to war against Iraq. I was able to apply caveat emptor. Most of my colleagues could not."
Funny how the Data was ONLY for the last six years.
How about Clinton making attacks on Iraq in 1998?
Clinton said "Saddam poses a major threat to peace in the middle east"
He also said that Saddam had nukes and this is why he ordered an attack.
It seem Donkey's have selective memory.
Oh well, the old "Flip-Flop"
Hey Iggy:
Clinton didn't send 140,000 troops to invade Iraq and have them bogged down there with no end in sight. Bush did, and as we can see, the "intelligence" to try to make it look like something other than a shitty idea was being thoroughly manipulated. If the American people and the Senate could see everything that Bob Graham could see, do you think they would have voted 'yes' on something that was based on people telling the Bushites what they wanted to hear, telling them things that further their pre-planned agenda as opposed to truthful information? Do you think the American people would support a war based on a bunch of "maybes" and "possiblys"? Bush and his ilk knew that would be an impossible sell, so they obviously shaped and twisted the "intelligence" until they got something that looked like what they wanted. Ever heard of the Downing Street Memo?
Notice how as soon as we begin blowing Bush's lies out of the water some Republinazi writes in with a "so's yer mother"-type childish comment regarding someone who hasn't been the president in five years? What the hell does Clinton have to do with the manipulating of intelligence regarding Iraq? Grow up asshole.
The real story here, is the fact that our government funding the operation that produced curveball and purposefully misused the intel he provided.
If you don't know who Rendon is, you really need to read this article.
The Man Who Sold the War
Meet John Rendon, Bush's general in the propaganda war
...Rendon is a leader in the strategic field known as "perception management," manipulating information -- and, by extension, the news media -- to achieve the desired result. His firm, the Rendon Group, has made millions off government contracts since 1991, when it was hired by the CIA to help "create the conditions for the removal of Hussein from power." Working under this extraordinary transfer of secret authority, Rendon assembled a group of anti-Saddam militants, personally gave them their name -- the Iraqi National Congress -- and served as their media guru and "senior adviser" as they set out to engineer an uprising against Saddam....
More on the Rendon group here..
The Rendon Group is a secretive public relations firm that has assisted a number of U.S. military activities in nations including Argentina, Colombia, Haiti, Iraq, Kosovo, Panama and Zimbabwe. Rendon's activities including organizing the Iraqi National Congress, a group created to foment the overthrow of Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein.
In a 1998 speech to the National Security Conference (NSC), Rendon described himself as "an information warrior, and a perception manager.
"Through its network of international offices and strategic alliances," the Rendon Group website stated in 2002, "the company has provided communications services to clients in more than 78 countries, and maintains contact with government officials, decision-makers, and news media around the globe."...
It's readily apparent that Judy was on Rendon's payroll, that explains how she got her "security clearance", and it's not much of a stretch to say that Woodward must be too.
That makes sense. I wonder if Bob Novak helped solely because he's a right-wing shitbird, or is he perhaps in the employ of Rendon Group as well?
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